Sid: We want everyone everywhere to pass up discouragement, to pass up uncontrolled anger, to pass up hurt feelings, to pass up strife.  To pass up just depression, can you image what God can do with you if you could do that 24-7? I mean not only pass these things up because you’re walking in such supernatural peace that is literally to you tangible and then it starts radiating out of you to other people, to situations, to your family, to your work place.  My guest Larry Hutton in 1977 had a personal visitation for the Lord and he was taught how to live in peace all the time, step by step.  And since 1977 he can personally say that he’s had many opportunities but he’s been able to walk in this peace ever since.  Larry these keys that you point out, I can feel the pleasure of God on making these keys available to everyone that’s listening to us.  We are going to go to a very important key in a moment, but tell me you know were in an imperfect world with it, with imperfect people and we have a devil running around like a mad man which he is.  And one day somehow your head started swelling, tell me about that.

Larry: Oh yeah, on the whole right side of the head it started swelling and pain started coming with it and then a little tumor started growing behind my ear.  And I was being attacked in my body, I’ve been attacked in different areas through the years and I know that Jesus already bore my sickness for me that I don’t have to have sickness and disease in my body and so when it came I started speaking the word of God and standing against like the Bible says use that shield of faith to stop every fiery dart that comes against you from the devil.  So I just started speaking the healing scriptures and the peace of God.  Let me tell you, when you have your head swelling and I mean it got, it got…

Sid: Now it was very easy to do that when nothing is going on.

Larry: Oh yeah.

Sid: But when the rubber hits the road is when something like that happens to you, you don’t feel like praying or doing anything.

Larry: But the one thing that I continually did was had headphones on and listening to scriptures, listening to the word of God on a daily basis so that I would stay strong in the Lord, not strong in myself.  Strong in the Lord and the power of His might.  So I had all of these attacks against my mind, I mean when your head’s swelling and the pain got so hard that you could hardly touch it with a brush and it was like okay, here’s all these thoughts coming.  Fear trying to come, you are going to die, it’s a brain tumor, it’s cancerous because I had people in my family die in past years of cancer and now it’s your turn you’re getting these thoughts bombarding your mind trying to get you in fear and depressed and discouraged.  And I remember just taking the word of God such as John 14 that Jesus gave me His peace and it’s not as the world gives, He gave it to me and now because I have His peace I don’t have to allow my feelings to be troubled.  I don’t even have to be afraid, John 14:27.  So I just took that, I said “Lord I have Your peace, I will not allow myself to be troubled, Jesus you are my peace, you’ve given me Your peace and that just kept me free from fear.”  Right in the midst of probably the hardest battle that I’ve ever gone through when it looked like man this is serious business, you could die from this and I was able to just stay free from fear and stay in peace and stay in rest.  And then of course because I knew that God took it all away I’m completely healed.

Sid: Now, you know I use to look many, many years ago at a man that was one of your teachers, Dr. Kenneth Hagen and he use to have all these miracles and all these wonderful testimonies like I’ve just heard you say and this was years ago not today and I use to say to myself, “This guy has got a gift and he’s just teaching on a gift and you can’t teach a gift, he has a gift, not everyone can do this.”  So I have to ask you that, and by the way that wasn’t true, but that’s what I thought when I first heard his teaching.  So what about the person that says well God is, look he personally visits you in 1977, you felt His presence, you’re walking in this supernatural peace, what would you say to this person?

Larry: Well, I found out the Bible says that God’s no respecter of person and what He’s done for one, he’s done for all.  He’s the just God and that whosoever would believe could receive, and so I found out about, because back then when I had that experience I was working at Delta Airlines.   I’m not a preacher, I’m not a teacher I’m just a person like everybody else going to work every day and going to church and then starting to hear the good news that Jesus is a miracle worker and He’s a peacemaker and He’s a Savior and a financer and He’s just good in all these different areas.  And so I just encourage people, I say listen “This is available to whosoever will let him come, this isn’t just for me, it just isn’t for Sid, or like you talked about Kenneth Hagen, these different people, this is for every member of the Body of Christ; every child of God.  And it’s definitely great, wonderful news.

Sid: Well, let’s release one of the keys, because Jesus taught you step by step how you can walk in 24-7 peace no matter what’s going on around you.  And you’re not talking Larry about being an ostrich; you’re talking about when you walk in this peace you’re walking in God, when you’re walking in God God turns everything around for good.

Larry: Right, somebody said to me one time that they’d didn’t understand when they found out that I called myself a believer and a faith person that I was referring to what the Apostle Paul said, “He said the word is near you in your mouth and in your heart.”  That’s the word of faith, that’s what I meant when I said I’m a word of faith is.  I believe getting God’s word in my heart and speaking it out of my mouth so God taught me that if I would speak His word over my emotions whenever things would try and rise that His grace then would empower me to overcome.  So I had to learn it, it’s kind of like back there in the Old Testament in 1 Samuel 30 when David encourage himself, of course you know that story; I mean all of his people that are closest to him turned against him.  Can you image like your family and your friends and everybody turns against you and there’s nobody to encourage you except yourself.  And that’s what happened and that’s what I found myself doing is, looking to God, encouraging myself.  I think in Psalm 103 when David said, “Bless the Lord oh my soul and all that’s within me, bless His Holy Name” I don’t think that he was singing a pretty little song, I think that he was encouraging himself in the Lord.  Because he went on and he said, “The Lord forgives all my iniquities and heals all my diseases and redeems my life from destruction” and he just kept going on and encouraging himself and so that’s what I have learned to do through the years.

Sid: Okay, let’s put you in that situation, everyone has turned against you, demonstrate to me what you would be doing at this moment if everyone had turned against, your loved most loved possessions, your family, your boss, your teachers, everyone, your neighbors, your friends you’re going through a real Job experience.  What would you be doing as far as this key of encouraging yourself like David?

Larry: Yes, I would be taking the word and just because I continually listen to it on a daily basis.

Sid: Now, I want you to do it right now.

Larry: Yeah, so I would take the word, and I would start going like this “Lord God, I thank You so much that you live in me, You are greater than anything in the world that I’m ever going to face including what I’m facing right now.  Your word says, “Greater is He who is in me than he that’s in the world.”  And Lord you said in Psalm 118 “That you are on my side.”  Lord if you are for me, who can be against me?  I mean it looks like all hells broken loose, but Lord, I’m letting all Heaven break loose, thank you Lord, that you live big in me and that you strengthen me and you quicken me, and you’re my comforter.  You’re my helper Lord, you strengthen me Lord, I thank you I have Your wisdom, I have Your peace, I have Your joy that’s unspeakable, full of glory and I refuse to allow people or things or circumstances to stop me from walking with You and living in Your peace and Your joy and Your rest.  Lord I believe, and You said, “That we which believe enter into rest.”  I’m entering into Your rest right now Lord and I’m staying there.  Thank you for helping me Lord; I praise You and I thank You for helping me.

Sid: Well, I don’t know about anyone else but I’m sure feeling the peace of God on that.  But I don’t have everything closing in on me like the description so you’re telling me if someone were to really believe and say that out loud it would do what it’s just done right now, It’s changed the atmosphere, it is changing the atmosphere in this studio by you just saying that.  So I’m sure it’s changing the atmosphere where you are right now.  And what’s going to happened beyond the atmosphere?  Is it going to change the fact that all these people are saying these lies and you’re misunderstood and is that going to change?

 

Larry: Just flat turn the whole situations around where there just not affecting us anymore and then all of a sudden we start finding favor with those people and then all of a sudden I mean just like in David’s life, those men that were against him all of a sudden they say okay this is going to be okay and the whole situation turns around just because I believe we get ourselves out of the way so that God can work in our lives.

Sid: Now you do some teaching on faith and fear, now give us a little bit.

Larry: Well, if you remember the story of the woman with the issue of blood, I mean incurable disease, you know she’s living in the dungeons and caves of the earth apart from her family, got a disease that has been declared unclean and so she can’t be around people and she touches Jesus.  Jesus didn’t pray for her, Jesus didn’t lay hands on her she used her faith and reaches out and took hold of the power of God and Jesus got done talking with her and if you remember the story, He’s on His way to Jairus’ house whose daughter was dying.  And people came right at the time He’s done talking to the woman with the issue of blood and the people tell Jairus your daughter dead, you don’t need Jesus any more just forget Him.  And Jesus immediately turned to turned to Jairus and said, “Don’t be afraid, only believe.” And He was letting Jairus know that fear and faith are opposites they can’t work together, they can’t coincide.  If you’re in faith, you are not going to be in fear, if you’re in fear then…

Sid: Oh, were out of time.

Sid: My guest Ruth Fazal is red hot for the Messiah; you see the Lord gave her in the Spirit a new violin bow, and when she plays things change, atmosphere changes.  As a matter of fact, tell me about, and we started on this story on yesterday’s broadcast Ruth of the time you were going through some problems in your life and you were laying on your bed and you felt your forehead being stroked.  Explain that.

Ruth: Yeah, this is really different; I mean I’m certainly use to knowing and feeling the presence of the Father, I mean that’s one thing.  But this was different and it was like I come in late at night and I go into bed and I felt as though somebody sat on the bed, you know like you’re in bed and someone comes and sits down and it’s like, it sinks a bit?  Well that’s what it felt like.  And just His presence there and just I felt this hand on my forehead and I just heard a voice saying “He just sent me to tell you how much He loves you.”  And it was just the most amazing amazing thing because it was different from, I mean, okay so the Father could have come and done the same thing and I just want to tell you how much I love you.  But there was something about the fact that He’d actually sent someone, He sent an angel I suppose to tell me that and that meant so much to me at that time, it’s incredible.

Sid: Did you actually feel the hand going over stoking your forehead?

Ruth: Yeah, I did, I did, I felt I felt that, I did feel, have to say I did feel it.  But do you know what, I didn’t see anything, I didn’t see anything.

Sid: And when you heard His voice, what was it like?

Ruth: It was the same kind of way that you hear for me that I hear God’s voice.  It wasn’t like an audible out loud voice; it was just that deep sense of knowing on the inside that that’s what was being spoken to me.

Sid: I love your CD “Joy in the Night,” because you are progressively going deeper and deeper into God, until you reach and capture His presence.  Let’s hear a selection from that called “I Cry out.” (Worship excerpt)  You know Ruth I told you that I’ve been listening to your soaking music, especially the first CD which we haven’t heard yet called “Songs from the River.”  And when I read about the angel stroking your head, as I’m soaking I visualize the Lord stroking my head and His anointing going into me.  And just by reading that and listening to your music I believe that I am being changed as I do that.  There’s so many things that are happening to people as they listen to your music.  But you have soaking meetings at your house, and all sorts of things happen, tell me about it.

Ruth: Yeah, well there kind of a little different, there not soaking meetings in the sense that I’m you know playing and soaking people, we have these night, we call them Glory Nights and the whole thing is just really to come into His presence and to wait and to see what He wants to do and what He wants to say.  So you know sometimes we might put one of my CDs on, but I’m not kind of on in that sense because I’m just taking part like everybody else.  But once in a while you know I’ll go over to the keyboard or I’ll just start to play and oh, gosh we’ve had some amazing encounters.  Sometimes…

Sid: Describe one of them to me.

Ruth: Well, I remember this one time, these evenings have really taught me about how to be childlike in realizing that when we’re childlike it’s often the time that we’ll find that God will meet us so powerfully.  And I’ve realized how so many times I’ve refused to be childlike because it just seemed to be too too silly.

Sid: Well, you know that same thing happened to me when I speak; I first started hearing Words of Knowledge of people being physically healed and I thought it was me. I didn’t realize it was God; it took me a long time to figure that out.

Ruth: Yes, so it’s a little bit like that, but I mean I remember there was one time for instance; this is just one example where Larry the guy who kind of leads or he sort of leads the meetings for us and he’ll just say something like, you know he really senses that God’s opening up something for us in the room and we need to just come into it.  And I remember seeing on the floor in the Spirit, not seeing physically but seeing in my spirit on the floor it was like a line and I just thought I heard the Lord say Ruth, I want you to get up and walk on that line.  And I’m thinking, “Oh, this is silly, you know I mean I can sit here in my chair and walk on the line in the spirit and it’s not like the line’s really there.  So anyway, but I felt, “Okay, I will I’ll be childlike, I will get up and I will walk on this line.”  And so I started and I started walking on this line, in a sense you could say it was an imaginary line, but it obviously wasn’t because as soon as I stepped on it I felt like I had stepped into something in the spirit and I was like I was walking a type rope.  And the Lord was, and He was causing me to be able to walk across this line and I walked right to one end of it and then I turned around and I came back and I just knew that it was the whole thing of not looking to the left or to the right.  And it was like it was this path the Lord was saying, “I’m putting you on this path, and that you are going to be able to walk on it and you don’t look to the left or to the right.  And it was such an encounter with Him, I would have totally missed that if I just decided to sit in my chair and sort of do it in the spirit if it were.  Ha-ha.  So you know from that point of realizing that okay, I’ve got to be childlike because otherwise I’m just going to miss so much that God wants to say and do.  And then I found that it was in times like this that when He would actually now start to give me things that would relate very much to my playing or to something that He was wanting me to write musically.  And so it’s been amazing and I’ve just, basically I’ve just decided okay, I will, I will be childlike because I don’t want to miss anything that God is wanting to say or to do.

Sid: When you play the violin, I can tell you this from personal experience there is such a deep, deep in fact I feel it as we are doing this interview; such a deep presence of God.  I think that all of the years that you soaked under that great outpouring of the revival in Toronto is coming out as you play that violin.  People are being healed of their spirit and their emotions and their bodies.

Sid: I think that there is such a coming together of Jewish and Gentile believers in the Messiah that will release well what Paul calls it a life from the dead resurrection power.  Now my guest Nasir Siddiki ancestry comes from Egypt and I just found out something I never knew, His great great grandfathers go back to the time of Mohammed and his ancestor was one of the best friends of Mohammed.  What do you know about this ancestor Nasir?

Nasir: Well Sid his name was Abuzoker Siddik and he was Mohammed closest friend and when Mohammed died he became the first ruler, or the first king, the first caliph of the Moslem nation and I’m in the direct line of Abuba Siddiki.

Sid: Now just out of curiosity when you’re in the Middle East or someone hears that, your last name do they realize that connection?

Nassir: Absolutely, if they come from a Moslem background, immediately they understand the line of Siddiki is here and of course Nassir Siddiki is a very prominent Moslem name.

Sid: Okay, you were very prosperous in business, and in fact you came from a prosperous influential Moslem family and by age thirty-five you made your first million, you had the fancy cars, you had the homes.  And then you developed a deadly, and I mean a deadly disease, I don’t think in terms of shingles as a deadly disease but tell me in your darkest hour how bad were you physically?

Nasir: Well, when it started as blisters on the side of my neck and overnight.

Sid: Yeah, I have had shingles and I remember I had it over by my waistline and it was very painful.

Nasir: Yes, it felt like somebody put gasoline on the side of my head and put a match to it and it was burning up.  They rushed me to hospital, Toronto General Hospital.  They diagnosed it as the worst case of shingles ever recorded in the history of that Hospital.  I remember I was in the emergency room trying to break a stretcher because the pain was so bad.

Sid: Had you ever experienced pain like that before?

Nasir: Never, never in my life.  And then they admitted me to hospital and the next morning from on the right side of my head there were blisters that were one inch in size covering my head, my ear, my neck, part of my shoulder, my chest and my back, in fact my ear was so covered in blisters it was touching my shoulder.  I looked like a leopard, I looked like the elephant man, I was deformed on one side.

Sid: I mean you went from the top of the world to a mess!

Nasir: Yes.

Sid: I image you must have said, “How can this happen to me?”

Nasir: Well, I was talking the doctors and they said, “We don’t know your immune system has shut down and your body is not fighting back.”  Shingles of course is a virus originally of the chickenpox family, but this one was over taking my body so quickly because my immune system had shut down because the previous eighteen months I was working eighteen hours a day, seven days a week, not eating right, not sleeping right, and I had literally worn my body down.

Sid: Well, did they expect you to die?

Nasir: I was there when the two doctors came in and they examined me and they said, “He probably will not last till the morning.

Sid: As I understand it, they thought you were sleeping or they would not have said that.

Nasir: Yeah, and they called Anita who later became my wife, called her out of the room and said to her, “Probably he will be dead by the morning, but if by chance he should live his right eye could be blind, the right ear deaf, the nerve endings on the right side of the face have been damaged; and because of the temperature of 107.6 hyperthermia had affected the brain and the brain had cooked itself and so they said, we don’t even know if he will be able to live as a vegetable because his brain has cooked itself and that was the good news.”  That night as I was lying in bed fast asleep I woke up and I heard a voice and as I opened my eyes I saw the outline of a person at the end of the bed.  And you know I knew that it was Jesus, now Moslems do they know Jesus?  Oh course they do if they would read the Koran Jesus is mentioned many times as a prophet, as good man, as a healer; and so Moslems are familiar with Jesus, but they just don’t acknowledge him as the Son of God.  A  nd this person was radiating light from them so I couldn’t see details of…

Sid: By the way, you’re probably aware of this as I am but it seems as though today I hear more stories of Moslems having dreams or visitations of Jesus than I ever remember.

Nasir: Yes.

Sid: And so you were kind of like a forerunner of this, so Jesus Himself came in and you had a knowing, you knew it was Jesus and then what?

Nasir: Then He said two things, and these are the only two words that I remember He said, “Number one I am the God of the Christians; number two I am the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.”  Now when you come from a Moslem background that is a very profound statement because the Moslems come from the line of Ishmael; so we as Moslems we believe in Father Abraham, but we believe that Ishmael was a son of promise.  So it’s Abraham, Ishmael, but no Jesus said I’m the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; and that was very profound to me.  And that’s all that I heard the same doctors that left me to die walked in the next morning and they said, “We do not understand what’s happened to you it has gone into remission instead of the blisters growing, they have started to shrink.”  In fact my case became a case study for the top doctors of the city of Toronto, why is this man still alive?  I told them that it was a miracle from Jesus, but of course they didn’t believe me.

Sid: Now wait a second, how in the…well they probably didn’t know that you were Moslem and came from such a prestigious Moslem background.

Nasir: Right.

Sid: But, did you find it strange saying that to them?  I mean you’re a sophisticated businessman, businessman, sophisticated businessman don’t say Jesus came.  Did you say, “Jesus came into your room,” or no?

Nasir:  “Said that Jesus came and healed me,” and you see when you get so close to death, I mean you see a bird in the sky, you can get excited.  I was just so excited that Jesus would come and heal me, but I did have one burning question, Sid.  “Is this Jesus, the Son of God, the way that the Christians claim or is he just a Prophet, the way that I had been brought up to believe all my life.”

Sid: And that’s interesting because may Moslems that have visitations can’t put it all together, that’s what happened to you.

Nasir: That’s exactly what happened.

Sid: So, what did you do with this quandary?

Nasir: Well, the next day…

Sid: Because if I know one thing, I know that a Moslem has problems with Jesus being the Son of God; that whole issue.

Nasir: And so the next day they released me from hospital, I went home and people would walk across the street because my head was still deformed, but it was shrinking.  And I had this burning question, “Is Jesus the Son of God?”  The next morning, in my home I woke up at 6:00 in the morning, I don’t know why I woke up that early, walked over the living room turned on the television and right on the screen were these words, “Is Jesus the Son of God?” the very thing that was in my heart.

Sid: Was it a program or was it supernatural?

Nasir: It was a program.

Sid: But it still was supernatural for you to see that.

Nasir: It was supernatural that I was watching it so early in the morning.

Sid: Yes.

Nasir: There were two men that just like you and I talking about this Jesus, and they answered every question in my heart.  How God loves the world and how He sent Jesus to die on the cross for you and I and alone in my living room the greatest miracle of all happened.  I dot down on my knees and I asked Jesus to be the Lord, of my life.

Sid: That is such as wonderful testimony but, you still didn’t know a whole lot.

Nasir: No.

Sid: What did you do now that you are a believer in Jesus; would you have called yourself at that point a Christian?

Nasir: No, I didn’t know any of these Christianese languages; I just ran out the next day bought me a Bible because I wanted to know, “Who is this Jesus that would come for a dying Moslem?”  And I read Matthew, Mark, Luke and John I wanted to find out about the life of Jesus.  And I remember somebody came to visit me a few days later and they said, “Oh, you believe in Jesus,” and I said “Yes, yes, he’s the Son of God, I asked Him into my heart.”  And they said, “You’re a born again Christian.”  I said, “I’m a what?” I didn’t understand any of those Christianese language; all I knew was that I had asked Jesus into my heart.

Sid: And boy you are going to be red hot for the Messiah when you hear my guest, he literally has received knowledge from God about World War III.  Before we get to that, John you had a series of visions in which the Lord came to you and told you things about the future, told you about the church, told you things about the way the First Church was and I’m fascinated by this.  I wonder if I take you back to what your first visitation in 1992.

John: Sure, sure that was one of those things that actually started my walk as a lot of people were on a long journey searching for the Lord’s will.  My wife and I had been praying that night and she had gone on to bed and I was sitting actually on the love seat in our living room, but suddenly my eyes were open into the Spirit realm and I saw Jesus about ten feet away.  And he said, “I have some things I want to share with you.”  And He came over Sid and actually sat down on the sofa and you know if you were to look in the natural with your eyes you would just see me sitting on my love seat that was kind of an L shaped you know the way that they were sitting.  But in the Spirit, I saw Jesus come over and sit down.  And he started with a kind of a history lesson of me; He told of where I came from with was the charismatic renewal of the ‘60s and ‘70s and He said, “What you would call the Charismatic Renewal.  Many people came out of the traditional churches because their needs were not being met.  And that’s of course you know what happened the Baptism of the Holy Spirit just exploded throughout all the denominations.  And they were saying and He continued as a result of the many prayer meetings and many home churches; many Para-church organizations were started as a result of all the people coming out of the traditional church because the wanted more of Him.  But He said, “Now that generation has grown up and started their own churches and then He looked at me and He said and you’re a product of those churches that came out of the Charismatic Renewal.  And He said, but now He said, “Many of these churches have become as rigid and inflexible and set in their own ways as the traditional denominational churches that preceded them.

Sid: Is there ever going to be a generation of true believer’s that won’t fossilize after a move of God’s Spirit?  It seems historically that always happens.

John: It does seem like that, it seem like man always wants to get in the way.  I think part of the problem is we haven’t really put the New Testament within the proper context within the reality of Christ in us the hope of glory.  The individual responsibility, the individual privilege we have as new creatures in Christ.  But you know that visitation got me started because He was talking, He went on to say that once again you will see people leaving these churches because they want more of me, because they’re needs are not being met.  And He started talking to me about again, I would hear of home groups, house churches, and other things just the same of what I participated in coming out of the denominational church to the charismatic movement.  So it’s a little bit of history lesson to think about, the churches that I thought were the on fire, the cutting edge in His eyes, many had become as inflexible and rigid as the denominations that preceded them.

Sid: Interesting, I came to the Lord in the early 70s and I came in just as the Charismatic Movement was you know at its heights so to speak, so I didn’t have to, I came out of Orthodox Judaism.  I didn’t really leave the church system to me that was normal, the Charismatic Movement.

John: Well, and that’s where I came into it too and you know I’m one who believe that the Book of Acts is normal Christianity and that is what I was looking for and I wasn’t always finding it within the structure of the traditional church although even though I was in leadership in that structure.

Sid: Now why did the Lord give you this history lesson?

John: Well, I think because I was really searching for and actually a long search of where He was moving, how I could actually flow.  I had been like, and I think many listeners would have been there where I felt like I never really fit in in the structure and I never felt like I was fully free to move in the things God had put in my heart.  And so and I saw people that would fall through the cracks and I saw people who were frustrated, who had legitimate God given gifts but it was like they were always waiting for permission from the Pastor, permission from the board to operate in that gifting; in that God given gifting.  And I just thought that you know there is, something has to be wrong if God given gift has to be continually submitted to a board or something.  And all these people with all these giftings are just sitting there in almost a spectator situation every single service while the anointed few participate in the things of God.

Sid: So you realized what was going on, you knew what was going on inside of you, but it took a second visitation from the Lord to really put it together.

John: Yeah, in February of 2001 I had been seeking the Lord as far as where He was moving next and what He was doing, much along the same lines contemplating that early visitation.  In the middle of the worship service, I was about to minister up in Toronto, Canada area and the Lord was about six or seven steps away and just came walking over to me and started talking and one of the things He said was that, “People are running to and fro to this meeting and that, while they’re neglecting the supernatural work in their heart in the their midst.”  And He said this, “He said, “The next move where I’m moving is not a move of the masses, but of the individual.  And as it was in the beginning so it must be now, I’m moving in relationships.  And that just opened up a whole world because I really believe that Christianity started out in Israel as a relationship with God, when God came to man.  And I like to say that it moved to Greece and became a philosophy and to Rome where it became a religion and to Europe where it became a tradition and part of a culture; and it moved to the United States and it became an enterprise.

Sid: You know that that was so good I would love for you to repeat that please.

John: It is that, let’s just do that.  Christianity started out as a relationship in Israel when God came to man.  It moved to Greece to become a philosophy; to Rome where it became a religion; to Europe where it became a tradition and part of a culture; and it moved to the United States and it became an enterprise. And what I believe God is bringing back the relationship element of Christianity and that’s what we see going on around the world.  That’s what we see going on below the radar of the traditional church here in the United States

Sid: So let me see if I’m understanding you right.  We had a great move of God’s Spirit, Charismatic move and from that came churches, second generation churches, Bible Schools etc.  Then that like all the other moves of God’s Spirit began to fossilize.  Then there were a few moves of God’s Spirit that sprung up in Toronto and Brownsville and Pensacola and Smithton and so people would run to these meetings but the Lord is saying is, if I’m understanding you right, were running for the external signs and wonders when His Spirit really wants to do a number on us internally in relations with Him and relationships with one another.  Is that what you’re saying?

John: That’s exactly what I’m saying.  And so after this visitation in February of ’01 I began really searching the Word and looking to see how church was done in the New Testament and then also you know the Word and the Spirit agree and I realize it to be accurate and to make sure that I was not going to get off I not only needed to find it in the Word but also needed to find what God was doing by His Spirit all over the World.  And I knew that the Spirit and the Word would be in agreement.  And I started hearing of the explosion of Christianity in China in home based Churches and all over India and such.

Sid: I mean here in the United States we’re praying for revival to hit in some of the numbers you told me before we went on the air, it’s unbelievable.  How many are coming to the Lord per day worldwide?

John: Worldwide there are about 175,000 people coming to the Lord every single day.  I heard a House Church Leader in China say as best as they can estimate there are one million Chinese coming to the Lord every single month.

Sid: If that’s true why do we hear that Islam is the fastest growing religion?

John: Because that’s the world media, that’s the popular media.  If you check out such place, reputable places such as World Mission they are documenting and other mission organizations who have their fingers on the pulse of what’s happening out there on the field, out there around the world, they all say the same thing that Christianity is growing at almost eight percent per year.  It’s an amazing statistic.

Sid: You know I’ve got your book which makes one of the most fascinating reads, it’s a now book.  The title is “Return of the First Church,” why did you write this book?

John: Because I was searching for fulfillment and I found that as I travel in my positions that I had done in terms of advising churches and Bible Schools around the world, I saw that essentially all the churches were the same even though they advertised that things were different.  And I wanted more of God, I wanted a time when the four of five songs of worship were playing and Holy Spirit was really moving, I didn’t want to get it cut off just to take receive the offering or cut it off to receive the announcements.  I thought surely there must be a structural way that God has where if the congregation wants to flow with Lord, the Lord can have His way, we don’t have to throw out the schedule.  And so I looked all around and saw that basically all the churches were the same, I thought surely the Bible has something to say about that.  And so that’s really the result of my study and partly my own journey of just rediscovering the First Church and seeing it’s emergence once again all over the world.

Sid: Did it provoke you to jealousy when you saw what was originally available which because of religion has fossilized?

John: Well, you know I’ve been in that traditional church all my life, since a teenager and it was one of those moments where you just think I’ve missed it; I’ve missed it as good as the Lord has been.  I know that the Lord fills whatever structure man gives Him; the Lord will use whatever man gives Him to the maximum extent.  I felt like, oh, where have I been?  Where have I been, why have I missed this?  Because now I tell you the fulfillment that I feel and what I see in others as they’re able to flow, as they’re empowered.

Sid: My guest Jonathan Welton, I’m interviewing on his brand new book, “The School of the Seers.”  This book is so important because Jonathan just before we went on the air you said to me that God is showing you this is His moment to restore that gift.  Comment on that.

Jonathan: Yes absolutely Sid, over the last hundred years we’ve seen the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit listed in 1^st Corinthians 12.  We’ve seen a restoration take place; we’ve seen tongues brought back into the body through Azusa Street.  We’ve seen healing take brought back to the church through the 1950’s revival.  We’ve seen a lot of different things that God is restored and right now I believe the Lord has His Finger on the gift of discerning of spirits.  And it’s really, as I study church history; I believe it’s the last gift of the nine that needs to be restored.   In fact the discerning of spirits has really had a bad reputation in the church.  We throw it to the side and say oh that’s just for deliverance or perhaps it’s the critical person that discerns things about other people in a negative way.  But I believe the true discerning of spirits is like when God spoke to Samuel when he was trying to find King David among his brothers he said, “Samuel you look at the outward man, but I look at the inward.”  I believe discerning of spirits is seeing people the way that Jesus sees them.  In the spirit their potential destiny, their calling, that it’s how God sees people.

Sid: Look how someone’s life would be changed if every congregation in the world had believer’s moving in discernment of spirits.

Jonathan: Oh, I believe there would be a tremendous move of love that would take place.  I think God’s had an agenda here as He’s restoring things.  He’s put the other eight gifts in place but I believe discernment is last on purpose because in Philippians 1:9 it talks about that we’re to abound in all discernment and love.  I believe if we see each other the way that Jesus sees us we’ll have a great move of love; because God loves each and every individual.

Sid: Do you know what I have found because I have been studying the gifts of healing and how healing operates for as long as I’ve been a believer.  And I’ve come to the conclusion that the greatest way for someone to manifest their healing is walking in God’s kind of love.

Jonathan: Awe, absolutely absolutely.

Sid: Now you told me that, I said to you, “I feel such a presence of God before we started this broadcast.”  And someone’s neck was just healed in Jesus Name.  And I said, Jonathan, “What are you seeing in the spirit? And describe what you’re seeing.

Jonathan: Well, as I’m here talking to you Sid, I’m seeing hanging in the air just a midst of oil, just that golden olive oil hanging in the air here.

Sid: Well, l in the scriptures oil is used to represent the anointing, people would actually take oil.  In fact in your book “The School of the Seers” you talk about in the first chapter someone should anoint themselves with oil to begin this activation.  I think God wants to anoint people for activation, moving in the gift of discernment of spirits with this oil right now; if you would pray for impartation.

Jonathan: Yes, absolutely.  The oil, he says there is an anointing for your eyes to see in Revelation 3.  And so I would like our listeners to put their…

Sid: By the way, I would like to interject one thing, some of you are saying “Oh I wish that Jonathan or the fellow we heard about yesterday in Brazil would just lay hands on me.  But my faith says that Jonathan has seen that oil and I believe that impartation is going to go all over the airwaves and every time you hear this CD you’ll be activated more and more because it grows the gift of discernment of spirits; but go ahead Jonathan.

Jonathan: Amen.  Well, if you can, if you’re not driving please put your hand over your eyes right now as I pray for you.  And I speak over your eyes right now; I speak the anointing for your eyes that they may see the Revelation 3 anointing over your eyes that they may see in Jesus Name.  I release impartation of the gift of discerning of spirits to you that you’re senses would be exercised to discern that they would be activated right now.  I speak activation over all five spiritual senses in the spirit man of every listener, in Jesus Name.  And I speak the eyes of your heart would be enlightened, the eyes of your heart would be opened and enlightened; that you would see the glorious riches of the inheritance in Christ.  That your heart would be able to see the reality of the unseen world that surrounds us in Jesus name.

Sid: And I believe that if you could see in the spirit what is going on right now, you are having the oil of Heaven come all over l you and I see ears being opened in Yeshua’s Name and backs being healed in Yeshua’s Name.  What peace Jonathan, anything more you seeing in the spirit?

Jonathan: Well, I would just suggest to any of your listener right now that this oil also brings healing to your bodies if you have a pain in your body somewhere, if you need a new organ, if you need a transplant from Heaven, I would ask you to put that on your body. Put your hand on your body where that issue is and I speak an impartation of this anointing oil onto your body in Jesus Name.  That healing would break forth right now, deaf ears be opened, blind eyes be opened, I speak to the cancer in Jesus Name I command you to die, I command health into every body for restoration with this anointing oil.  And if you receive the impartation on your eyes you might be feeling overwhelming presence of the Lord, your eyes may even feel heat on them and that’s the Lord just allow Him to do this impartation into your life.

Sid: Now when you’re talking about healing you’ve got to briefly tell me about that meeting that you had of 5,000 home group leaders in Brazil.

Jonathan: Oh, that was tremendous, I wasn’t the speaker I was there on the prayer team, but we saw the Lord sweep into this meeting with 5,000 home group leaders and it was so overwhelming.  There was literally a mist in the air in the physical realm where your shirt would get soaked because the presence of the Lord was so strongly in the building at the time.  We saw, I saw one woman I prayed for who had a let that had three inches of missing bone and we asked her “Do you want to be taller or shorter?”  And she said, “Well, I’d rather be shorter.”  So we asked the Lord to shrink the bone in the other leg so that she would match.  And she took her shoes off and she walked in a circle and you could hear crunching and when she got back around after doing one circle she was standing on feet that were even for the first time.

Sid: Were there many miracles at that time?

Jonathan: There were many, there were tremendous miracles.

Sid: Well, you describe a wind for two hours.

Jonathan: Yes, there was a wind in the building that was so intense it literally blew over a section of four hundred of the church chairs and no one was sitting in that section, but the church could seat 10,000 and this section of 400 chairs blew over.  And there were plants all threw out the church stage that were blowing around and it was like the day of Acts; the day of Pentecost in Acts Chapter 2 with a mighty rushing wind.  I stepped outside the church because I like to test things out and it was peaceful and calm with no wind.  But when I stepped back into the church only a few feet away from someone I would have to yell for them to hear me because of this roaring of this wind going on.  The Presence was that strong in the building at the time.

Sid: Are we about ready to see this in America?

Jonathan: I believe so, we’ve had brief outbreaks and I believe we’re getting trained and equipped throughout the Church and the body of Christ.  People are hungry and we’re hungry for the miracles we see in the word to break out in our continent

Sid: I want you to pray a prayer, a closing prayer right now that the on switch would be switched on for the gift of discernment of spirits with everyone that is listening right now.

Jonathan: Yes Lord, well I come before You Holy Spirit and I ask that you would touch each of our listeners right now.  I ask that you would switch them to on that they would begin to see things in a new way that they could see through the eyes of Jesus and eyes of love and see in the spirit, bring healing to others, bring deliverance of others.  That this is not for entertainment, but Lord that this is for the body to rise up into health and that you would restore this gift to Your Bride right now in Jesus Name we ask for that switch to flip in the spirit of every believer that they would see in the unseen like Paul said to fix our eyes on the unseen.

Sid: Now, my guest Delores Winder had one of the greatest healing miracles of the twentieth century, one of the greatest healing miracles I have ever heard of, it’s totally verified.  The biggest skeptic will not be a skeptic when they read this story, I mean and the thing that is so wonderful about her testimony is then she has spent many years after having this miracle wherever she goes miracles break out.  And as a matter of fact Delores, tell me about this person in Tuscaloosa, Alabama who had cancer throughout his entire body.

Delores: Yes, Glen.  Glen, it was quite unusual, he had his diagnosis the day before we saw him and he came home and this man met him and asked how it went, and he said, “There’s cancer everywhere.”  And this man said to him that I was still there, “Would he come up and let me pray with him?  And he came up and the Lord spoke to me something I have not ever heard before nor since, “He said, I have woven, tell him I have woven myself into him when I formed him in his mother’s womb.”  And I spoke those words to Glen and it was like a motor started running and his whole body started shaking.  And he got up and started walking and just, oh praising the Lord, and just walking.  And he was totally healed; he still goes back to MD Anderson to explain to them what has happened to him.

Sid: How long has it been since he was headed?

Delores: I think that it has been a couple of years and he works now with our team over in Tuscaloosa.

Sid: But tell me about Steve who had three back surgeries.

Delores: And Steve is here with me right now, sitting and he had surgeries; they couldn’t do anymore for him he had a lot of pain a lot of trouble, couldn’t walk and they had ordered a wheelchair.  The VA had ordered a wheelchair for him gave him a new cane so he could have the cane.  And I turned around this night and he was just coming in the door of the church and he looked more like me than anyone else I had seen.  He was bent over shuffling and he looked up and I saw the pain and I said, “Oh, Lord do something.”  Well, they moved him and his wife and his daughter and his granddaughter up to the front row and I said “Lord, tell me when.”  And in the midst of my speaking the Lord said, “Now and I went over to him and I said to him, and sometimes the Lord let’s you have a little bit of fun.”  I said to him, “Are you ready?”  And I knew that he was not really willing to be there that night, he wasn’t tuned in to it.”  And I said, “Are you ready?”  And he looked at me and said, “What?” And I said, “Are you ready?” And he didn’t answer me, and I said to him, “Give me your cane.”  And he finally handed me his cane, and I said, “Now get up.”  And he put his hands on the chair and I wish I would have had a camera because the look on his face when he stood up.  And I said, “What’s wrong?”  He said, “I don’t have any pain.”  I said, “No, now walk.”  And he started shuffling a little bit and I said, “No pick up your feet and walk.”  And he picked up his feet and he started walking and he started yelling, “I can’t do this, I can’t do this,” running and ran up on the platform and then came off the platform and went to sit down.  I said, “Wait a minute, woe, this man needs a back healing.”  He has a bad back, pray for him.”  And he kind of whispered to me, “I don’t pray out loud,” and I said, “You do now, pray for him!”  He prayed with the man and the man got healed and I haven’t been able to stop Steve since then, he’s on the go.

Sid: Delores there has been this entire week such a special and that’s the only way I can describe it, such a special healing presence of God.  I happen to believe that that same healing angel that was with Kathryn Kulman is with you right now.  Is that possible?

Delores: There’s someone who has a lot of sweating in their hands, that sweating is ceasing right now and it will not be any longer.  And someone and I think that they have had hip surgery and they are still having a problem, they have had something done with the hip and I think that it’s a hip joint put in or something.  And right now the Lord is taking that and making it whole and I thank God for what he’s doing.  But Sid, the one thing I want to say is “Gifts of healing are for the body of Christ and anyone filled with the Holy Spirit can operate in those gifts.  It is not for special people; certain people have stronger gifts then others.  But when there’s healing need, if we are a Christian and we know the Holy Spirit and let Him work through us, He is going to heal through any Christian.”

Sid: Delores, I believe because the presence, the healing anointing is here right now and I believe everyone that is listening, if you have something wrong in your body, put your hand on the part of your body that you have the illness.  If its heart, put your hand on your heart, if it’s your knees put your hands on your knees, if it’s a migraine headache put your head.

Delores: There is someone being healed of a lung condition right now, and burning stomach, stomach burns every time they eat, the burning comes, they almost don’t want to eat.  That‘s going away right now.  There was an irritation of the lining of the stomach and the Lord is just pouring healing balm into that, pouring it in.  There is someone whose having their feet healed right now, they have a lot of, it’s not pain in their feet but a lot of burning, just a foot problem; not really pain, but burning in the feet and that is disappearing even as your walking right now, it is disappearing.  Somebody is having a problem with TMJ on the right side and that is being healed right now move your mouth, but thank the Lord and praise Him as you’re doing it and see that be gone, that hinge is closing in again where it should be, and we thank you Father for it.  Thank you Lord, we give you praise for it.  There is backs being healed, not one I don’t know how many, but backs healed, if people that have been sitting down, stand up and feel the sensation going into your back of healing, of wholeness coming upon it.  I have no idea how many, thank you Lord, thank you Lord.  Thank you, someone and I think it was a former football player who’s had knees surgery and has had problems with your knees since then and that knee will never give you a problem again.  It is somebody who was very athletic in sports and I think it was football that’s being healed right now.  Thank you Lord.  There is someone praying for that child, they don’t know what’s wrong with that child, but doctors can’t seem to do anything.  If that child is with you right now I want you to lay your hands on him it’s a little boy, lay your hands on him and let the Holy Spirit use you to pour that healing through him to totally take that away that as doctors check him again, he’s fine.  There is a man that’s lived in so much fear; it has been very difficult for you to even leave the house.  God is removing that fear as the Holy Spirit is touching you and pouring Himself into you, that fear is gone, in the name of Jesus don’t take it back, don’t take it back you’re free in Jesus name.  There’s a woman grieving a loss of her husband and he’s been gone at least three years.  I’m seeing the figure three and I think it years, I don’t think its months, I think its years; and you’re still grieving “God says shake off the grief now and begin to live for I have work for you to do.”  Thank you Lord, somebody with something wrong with the muscles, muscles are detraining, I have no idea what it is, but you know and the Lord is filling those muscles with new strength, new life pouring Himself into you.  Thank you Jesus.

Sid: Delores our time is slipping away, but those who put their hands on their body under this anointing you are healed especially backs right now.  Delores tell me very very quickly about one person that was healed when they read your book “Surprised by Healing” which is teaching as well as full testimony.

Delores: Yes, it was a woman who was working at the college and she did not believe in any of this and we go down there once a month to Louisiana College, Southern Baptist College; wonderful spiritual people now and this woman wouldn’t come to meet me or anything but was always hanging around.  And the one professor said to her, if you won’t read her book, don’t come around here again.  And so she took she took the book and she had a bad stomach and she read the book and said, “I believe this is real.”  And said Lord, “If this is real, I am going to lay this book on my stomach and You’re going to heal it.”  And she woke up the next morning without that problem.”  There are people receiving the Lord right now who never believed He was real, and that is so important.  Oh, Lord God touch them in a mighty way, I see at least ten people in different places that are receiving Jesus, He’s opened up there heart, He’ll fill it with the Holy Spirit.  Thank you Lord, let Sid know what’s happening and we thank you Jesus.

Sid: That same presence that you’re feeling right now; that same presence of the Spirit of God is on this book, it pulsates with the presence of God.  The same anointing that was on Kathryn Kulman is on Delores Winder…

Sid: My guest, David Herzog just got back from Israel and he saw Jewish people coming to the Lord, but then he spoke at a congregation of Arab pastor whose a friend of mine and tell me what happened there David.

David: Well, it was amazing I went over there and it was so packed out, people were, literally had to put chair outside and Muslims, a lot of Muslims were in there.  And a woman with her veil runs in and screams please pray for my husband, he’s sick.  And so I started calling out miracles and all these healing took place, and basically by the end of the service we calculated at least thirty-five Muslims received the Lord, Arabs and Muslims as they’re Lord and Savior.  And it was such an amazing time, you know being Jewish and going into an Arab church it was just amazing and the love that was between us and the unity, it was just really really awesome.

Sid: Well, guess what I feel such a strong presence of God as you began to shard what happened in that congregation.  Were there really an unusual number of healings?

David: I don’t remember how many, but it was our first night in Israel, we were still in jet lag.  Image, we had just come in and boom the first thing we do is that, and there was a lot of healing and a lot of miracles.  I can’t remember everything that had happened, it was kind of a blur, but it was just; it exploded basically.

Sid: David, I am feeling such a presence of God just on what you’re saying, I image what happened when you were there.  I almost feel like now, I don’t have arthritis in my fingers, praise God, but I almost feel the presence of God is getting so thick that if someone were to just take, if they had a pain in their hand, and arthritis in their fingers and just reached into the glory which is right in front of you and you’ll be totally pain free.  How could you have pain in the glory?  And someone’s neck has just been healed.  David, what are you, are you sensing what I’m sensing?

David: Yeah, I feel heavy heavy glory and presence and I’m seeing someone’s got a cyst or tumor and I just command it to go in Jesus name, there is a back scoliosis and a disk in the lower back is being recreated, reformed.  There is a lot of, even if you don’t hear us call out your thing just reach out and do something with your body you couldn’t do before.  Lay hands on it because God’s healing a lot of bodies as we speak.

Sid: Well, I believe that if someone if there driving, they pull to the side of the road, or if you are in your kitchen it’s like the glory is coming right out our discussion right now.  And all you have to do is put your body part in the glory and I mean give me a break, what is stronger?  Nothing is stronger than the presence of God.

David: That is so awesome; I feel it all over my body right now.  You know when you talk about an event; you know there is no time in the glory.  I would teach about that and so when you talk about an event like the Arab church, it actually takes you there in the Spirit, in the Spirit there is no time.  So past, present, future so as we are talking and people are imagining what we are saying, there actually are being taken to that glory, that’s why they’re feeling it when you talk about something it starts to manifest.

Sid: Well, I’m sensing that peoples ears are opening, people that are deaf or you might have ringing in the ears, just put your ears in that glory right now.  You say Sid, “Where is the glory?”  It’s all around you, just put your head.  “I don’t feel anything.”  Doesn’t matter take our word, the presence of God is there; go for it, got for the gold.

David: Yeah, talk about gold; I see people’s teeth turning to gold right now. I see black teeth and grey teeth turning to bright gold and bright silver, even crowns and fillings, just lay hands on your mouth as I’m speaking that.  I just release angels of dentistry from Heaven into your mouth.  And cataracts, spots and floaters on your eyes even blindness, I just command the eyeballs to be recreated and every blindness to go in Jesus name.

Sid: What is and you may not be able to answer this question, but what is in your opinion your favorite miracle that has occurred in the glory when you have ministered?

David: Wow that is a tough one.

Sid: I know, I told you that it was going to be tough.

David: You know you see so many of them, you excited about all of them, oh man.  Well, the dead being raised in Africa was a powerful one, I didn’t get to physically see it I just called it out and someone was raised.  So it was fun but it would have been more exciting if I was there watching it but oh gosh I don’t’ know, every time I see a blind eye opened, every time I see, it’s hard to say, every time I say, I don’t have any one favorite, I’m just so excited anything that God does, to me is just amazing that He comes down and body parts are recreated.  It’s hard, I’m trying to think of one specific one and I’m having a hard time.  I love it all, when the bald heads grow hair, when paralytics start to walk, I just love everything.

Sid: How about creative miracles, have you ever seen a body part materialize?

David: Oh yeah, we’ve seen body parts recreated, we’ve seen people with no teeth, like a grandma with literally no teeth and I command teeth to come in.  I say someone is getting teeth, check your mouth and four teeth began to pop in her mouth.  So that’s a creative, I mean nothing was there and then it’s there.  We’ve seen tattoos begin to disappear off people in Oklahoma one time, a lady had all these demonic symbols on her skin and she had just received Jesus and she didn’t want them anymore.  And I said, “Someone has something on your skin” and I was thinking that it might have been a rash you know “And God’s fading it out of your skin.”  Well her tattoos began to fade.

Sid: I know I was in one meeting with you when the glory cloud came in, but does this happen often?

David: Well, I feel the glory at every meeting, but we don’t always see the cloud, like physically see the white cloud, that does not happen all the time.

Sid: Well, tell me about the one in Portland, Oregon?

David: Oh yeah, that was unusual, in Portland, Oregon I’m there speaking and suddenly towards the end to the service and we look up and there’s this swirl like just kind of cloud like swirl.  It’s a high high ceiling so it’s going all the way up and in there there’s feathers and sparkles of gold and I don’t know what the heck.  And it was like this little glory twister that just kept moving in the congregation.  It was amazing; I had seen it before in Mahesh Chavda meeting.  I remember and I was there and it was wow, this was amazing.  And I think I received something from that service because it was a few months later that it was almost the same manifestation happened up in Portland.

Sid: Now when that cloud came in what was the result of it?

David: Ah, people were just like wow, it was so much easier to move into healings, it was so much easier to see people saved, just because a sign and wonder makes people open there hearts to wow, God is real, He’s not just words but He’s showing up right here.  It just changes people’s faith and their hearts and people start worshiping God even more.  Just great great fruit comes from it; I always judge it by the fruit.

Sid: Now, I know that you’re not just talking.  I know that you do what you say, but how important has your sowing into Jewish people into their salvation, into Israel affected your ministry, your family?

David: Oh yeah, from the very beginning, even when we were in France when this revival started, I started sowing into ministries that were sowing into Jewish people and I do it even today.  We sow into your ministry and I notice every time I do that there is an exponential increase.

Sid: Now just out of curiosity, I looked on the computer, you just sowed into our ministry; I know that as a fact.  Did you see results on that yet?

David: Yeah, immediately I sowed into your ministry not too long ago and just this past weekend I saw Jewish people being saved and I sowed into your ministry because you’re going for Jewish people to know there Messiah and now I’m getting to see that.  Besides the glory increasing and the miracles and God blessing financially.  But the greatest thing I’m seeing Lord, I want to reach Jewish people like Sid is doing.  So I’m seeing an increase in that.

Sid: And I think that it’s so wonderful, I see your girls at the meeting and dancing and they really love the glory of God too, don’t they?

David: Oh yeah, they are born in it, my girls love it.  In the womb they have the glory I think, they just love the presence of God, they feel its home to them.  The glory is home so I don’t think that they could ever image not being in it because they were just kind of born into it.

Sid: And that’s what you want, that’s your passion, you want to see everyone like your daughters…

Sid: Hello. Sid Roth here with John Waller. And John is now a free man and he’s a worship leader in a church in Colorado. And he’s really writing brand new music, music that people have never heard before. And it’s got to do with blessings and breaking curses. And so his pastor says one day, “This music is too good just for our church. It’s got to get out.” And so they take up an offering. John, what was it $40,000?

John: Yes.

Sid: And you produce a record. And then there’s a waiting period. Tell me about that.

John: Well we had done the record. God was so, it was effortless, you know. When God is in something it can be just so easy, you know. No striving. But after we finished it, we sent it out to some people that we knew could help us get it around the world. And for about six months, we heard absolutely nothing. And that was in the pain of my waiting that a friend of mine encouraged me to keep being faithful where I am with what I have and what I know to do. And that’s when I wrote the song, “While I’m Waiting”.

Sid: Then how did that song become the main song for “Fireproof”, the movie?

John: Well you know, I wrote the song in 10 minutes’ time.

Sid: Ten minutes?

John: Ten minutes. Because I had lived it for 17 years, it was so natural to write it. But then after I wrote the song, a month later I got a call to fly to Nashville, got signed to a record deal, did my first album. And then I was having a hard time getting it played on the radio. A lot of times in Christian music, radio is the biggest format to get music out there. But I was having a hard time getting played. And so all of a sudden I get a call that there’s a movie just made called “Fireproof” and that my song was perfect for the movie, and thank you for letting us use it. But no one told me what the song was. I just got a message on my voicemail and I find out it’s “While I’m Waiting”, one of the songs at the end of the album. No one ever commented on this song, but yet now it’s going to be in a movie.

Sid: And today, John has studied the ancient Jewish blessings. Why is this so important to be released in music?

John: Well it is the blessing that breaks the power of the curse. If life and death is in the power of the tongue, then how much more when we speak the blessing over someone will they receive life. If we can take life away by speaking a curse over someone, how much more can we give them life?

Sid: Now you’re going to hear a song called “Bless Us and Keep Us”. You say so many miracles happen when people receive this blessing on them. Give me an example of one.

John: Well first of all, wherever I go it’s so rare that anyone that men have ever been blessed in their lives by their fathers. I mean, it’s rare. And yet, the Jewish fathers are still doing this today. And so I’ve really studied this. And so I was blessing some men one time at a marriage retreat, and I sang this blessing, “Bless Us and Keep Us” over the men. And it was a blessing over a friar man in Manasseh. “May the Lord make you like a friar man in Manasseh, forgetting the troubles of your past, having a fruitful future. And this man came up to me and said, “When you sang that over me, God delivered me from an addiction of pornography.” Now he came up to me months and months later and he had been free for a while and he said he saw a vision of God taking an eraser and erasing all these images that had been plastered in his mind.

Sid: People get set free from depression when they’re blessed.

John: That’s right.

Sid: I mean, because the blessing overtakes that curse it can’t stand. Would you go to the music set right now and I want you to hear him sing, “Bless Us and Keep Us”. But before he does that, I’m going to bless you the way God instructed Moses to bless the Jewish people. He said, “I’m going to put my blessing in the Jewish people. I’m going to put my name in the Jewish people.” The Lord will bless you. The Lord will keep you. The Lord will cause His countenance to shine upon you and be gracious to you. The Lord will grant you his Shalom. That’s His completeness in your spirit, in your soul and in your body in the name of the Sar Shalom, the Prince of Peace, Yeshua Ha’Mashiach [Hebrew], Jesus the Messiah, our righteousness. And now I want, something about music that supernaturally causes the Word to go inside of you. Something about these ancient biblical blessings. I believe that as you hear John Waller sing, “Bless Us and Keep Us”, that you’re going to receive an impartation of the name of God. Let’s go to that now.

John: Lord, bless us and keep us. Make your face to shine upon us. Raise your countenance on us and give us peace. Lord, bless us and keep us. Make your face to shine up us. Raise your countenance on us and give us peace. Shalom, peace. For our sons, Lord, make our sons like a friar man in Manasseh, forgetting all the troubles of their past and having a fruitful future. Lord, make our sons like a friar man in Manasseh, forgetting the troubles of their past and having a fruitful future. O Lord, for our daughters, Lord, make our daughters like Sarah and Rebecca, like Rachel and like Leah, who built the House of Israel. Lord, make our daughters like Sarah and Rebecca, like Rachel and like Leah, who built the House of Israel. O Lord, we pray.

SID: Hello. Sid Roth here with Ryan Wyatt, and Ryan, what’s it feel like when you’re speaking for a large group and the most powerful witch in New York shows up to your meeting? Now you’re a young man, but you started young. And you have such a passion for people to do what you do. Why do you have such a passion for them? Why not just you become a superstar?

RYAN: Because this is normal Christianity. And I think our standard of what it means to be a Christian has been lowered. It’s very good to attend a church and be committed, and planted and rooted. But it’s not just about attending a church. It’s about living like Jesus. Jesus, the Bible says he was the first born among many brethren. In other words, Jesus came and lived his life on the earth as a man anointed by the Holy Spirit. Yes, he was God, but he was anointed by the Holy Spirit, and he modeled the lifestyle that’s available for us. This is normal everyday Christianity.

SID: So it’s time, Ryan is saying, come on. The water is great, not the water he was freezing in, the water of the Holy Spirit. It’s time for you to get in the act. I mean, it’s the final scene before the wrap-up. What are you waiting for? Well let’s find out about the top witch in New York City that shows up at his meeting. What happened?

RYAN: Yeah. I was ministering in the East Village. And before the meeting, I had gone into what the Bible calls a trance. And Peter, the apostle Peter, had a trance, a very common experience in the New Testament. And I was shown a vision of prophesying over a girl. And as I prophesied to her, the Lord said a sign and a wonder would take place. And Sid, the presence of God came from behind me and moved right through me, and touched this girl. She began to weep and we watched as the presence of God moved back seven or eight rows. And each row that it hit, people would begin to weep. It was like a localized Glory of God. And at the end of the meeting, a woman walks up to me, who had been sitting on that last row, and she says, “Ryan, I am one of the most powerful witches in the East Village of Manhattan.” She says, “I have known spiritual power from the time I was born.” She said, “I’m a palm reader.” She said, “I have never experienced power, though, like I did in tonight’s meeting.” She said, “As you would talk about Moses and the Glory of God and how it’s available for us today, light would begin to fill the room like I had never seen before.” She said, “That presence that moved back through the crowd was like a cloud of light.” And she was seeing it all in the Spirit. She said, “When it touched me, Ryan, I’ve never felt love in my life that I know of.” She said, “But in that moment, I felt what felt like tangible liquid love.” And she said, ” Ryan, I want to know this Jesus that you speak of because I’ve never know power like that in my life.”

SID: Talking about power, tell me about the time you’re in your motel room. You’re meditating on the Word of God and you have a guest come in, but the door is locked, but the guest is in there? Who was that guest?

RYAN: Right. I was just praying and the temperature in the room suddenly, instantly changed. It became very warm. And I began again to vibrate and feel that presence of God coming, and Jesus walked into my room. And he was covered…

SID: That’s got to be so, Ryan, that’s never happened to me. What’s wrong with me?

RYAN: You know what? It’s available. He doesn’t always come like that. He comes in different ways.

SID: No, I understand. That’s so wonderful. So what did he say to you? What did he do? What did you do?

RYAN: I was weeping, for one, and he was dripping with oil from head to toe. And as he stood next to me, I became covered in oil: my skin, my hair, my clothes. And he said to me this, he said, “Ryan, I am desperate hungry that my people would lay whole of their full inheritance.” And he showed me images of the cross and how many of us look at what the price he paid on the cross is just being saved. But being saved is simply the entry door to a lifestyle of the supernatural and experiencing the Kingdom. And Jesus is not wanting us to wait until we go to Heaven to experience Heaven or to experience the Glory of God. It’s for now. The Kingdom of Heaven is here right now. God is now. It’s at hand.

SID: We do investigations of our guests and we investigated about the rain that occurred inside Ryan’s home. Tell me about that.

RYAN: Yeah. I just had a group of friends over and some of the leaders from my church, and we were watching television, talking about the things of God. And suddenly, I felt raindrops hit my skin. And I saw a slight mist in the room. And as I began to talk about it with my friends, it increased. And this mist literally moved over our sectional couch and we began right then to have an experience of the Glory of God, just like Moses did, just like the priests did in the Temple. And every single person on that sectional couch felt the rain. You could put your arm, your hand into the cloud and pull your hand out and it would be covered in like dew, moisture.

SID: Now when someone feels that rain, what is God doing? Because I have felt that.

RYAN: I just believe that God loves us so much; He wants us to experience Him. And many people ask “What’s the purpose of the supernatural?” And you know, Sid, the number one answer is intimacy with God. It’s not always about nation-shaking stuff, although God does that.

SID: What is the single best way for you to have intimacy with God?

RYAN: Hunger.

SID: I know. But you can’t just say, okay, I want to be hungry. If you’re not hungry, how do you get hungry if you’re not hungry?

RYAN: I tell you what, I feed myself on what’s available. And that’s what I teach when I go around the world. I awaken the church to the reality that God is a now God. He’s not just the God of the Old Testament.

SID: So give me one tip if I’m not hungry, what I should do. Give me one tip.

RYAN: Feed yourself on the encounters in the Bible and remind yourself that He’s the same God today. And I say to God, I say, God, if they can live that lifestyle, then why can’t I?

SID: Why can’t you? If they can live it, why can’t you? Are you Swiss cheese? No. God is not a respecter of persons. What He did for Ryan, what He did for me, He’s about ready to do it for you. Don’t go away because I have an idea there’s going to be an explosion of miracles. We’ll be right back.

Sid: I believe that my guest, Michael Galiga, Michael has quite a background in domestic and international real estate; his clients read like a Who’s Who.  He was trained by Sam Walton; and many others; he graduated law school and graduate school and he was trained by the best of the best.  And he found out that there was a moment in history when he found out that God had put a mantle on him when he was just five years of age.   Now what was this mantle for Mike?

Michael: Sid, it was it’s a mantle of leadership, it sounds a little strange to somebody that is not familiar with it, but God has done this throughout history He’ll pick out people for a mission; something special and He’ll give them massive leadership skills, it’s called a mantle of leadership.

Sid: And on yesterdays broadcast you started a story which I didn’t give you time to finish; would you finish that now.

Michael: Well Sid, you know the corporate challenge is something I have in the book and it’s a challenge to any company, any corporation in America that is of a household name that people would know, because I want it to be high profile.  But the basic premise is that companies in this country; and of course many of the big ones are dinosaurs; there dying because they’re foods run out simply put.  And the only way that they’re going to survive and I’d say General Motors, no offense to those people; but I’m really sorry for a lot of people losing their pensions etc.  But the only way to survive; and I can feel this spiritually and I look at the balance sheets and the problems and the completive pressures and they’re dead unless they can have one thing that they can do to save them and that’s the intervention of God.  Sounds silly, but I’m a businessman, I already said, I didn’t go to seminary or anything, there is one way is for them to come clean before the Living God.  It sounds really bazaar, but one of these companies is going to take me up on this offer.  And the press is going to focus on it and let’s use General Motors for instance in that life of a large company like that things go wrong, people lie, cheat and steal that’s how fallen nature is so there’s plenty of things to turn from and I’m not picking on General Motors, I’m using them as an example.  Let’s say okay, Mike come on in and I’d meet with a hundred of their executives.  We go to personal level first and say “Where are we not with God?”  Let’s get clean with Him, let’s be as one with Him.  And then we’d go to the corporate background and we do research; where did we steal?  Where did we lie?  Where did we cheat?  Things like that; we clean that up and we repent from it, we change our way and we turn back toward God; we make if right as best we can.  Then we anoint with oil all the facilities and the offices and sounds bazaar to people, that don’t know this kind of language.  But when this happens Sid, the press will find out about it and they’re going to focus on it; there’d be cameras running on it and they’re going to go, “This guy is a nut and I can’t believe these executives are doing it.”  But the reason that they are going to do it Sid is because they have no choice.  There is nowhere for them to go to get another job, they’re fifty-five years old.  They make a $1,000,000 a year or 10 or $20,000,000 a year there is nowhere for them to go; they have to this.  So somebody’s going to do it and then God’s going to show up and say, “That’s what I’ve been waiting for; you’ve come clean with me.”  The vision that I have is that General Motors or somebody like them will do this and there months away from the cash running out and their history and that God shows up in the research facilities.  Late one night there’s a researcher there and she get’s this vision and she starts writing it out on her white board, you know it’s twenty feet long, it’s a formula for a battery and this battery will run a car for three years on a short charge.  And they pull in the patent attorneys and all the other executives from all around the world in forty-eight hours they file patents from all over the world within two weeks they own the automobile business.  They own lots of businesses, in a forty-eight hour period they will have gone from bankrupt to the richest company in the history of the world because that battery changes every industry.  It changes the oil business, the gas business, the electric business, the car business, anything that can run on electric power, even things that don’t run on electric power like airplanes, you can power airplanes off this battery; you don’t need to fuel anymore.  So everybody would have to come to General Motors to get a license to use it.  It’s a download; the Bible says that Jesus created everything.

Sid: Your saying that whether it’s a large corporation that is about ready to go under or whether is just a person in a family that has a bad relationship with their spouse or with their children, or someone that’s unemployed; whatever the situation, they can win every battle when the follow these principles.  I was amazed when you talked about the Tucker Torpedo; would explain that to me?

Michael: Well, first of all Sid, there’s no absolute definitive proof that anybody knows of, but there’s a lot of allegations so I give General Motors, I’m not slandering them in any way.  I’m not saying bad things about them, but there certainly was a lot of smoke, we don’t know if there is fire, okay.  But there was allegations that Ford, and Chrysler, and General Motors trumpet up charges against Mr. Tucker and the Tucker Torpedo, because it was many, many years because it was decades above and beyond the technology at the time and had he…

Sid: But people don’t understand what that car was, explain.

Michael: Oh, it was a car that was probably ten fifteen above it’s time, it had all kinds of technology, head lights that would turn when you turn the steering wheel and it goes on and on with the technology that was in the car.  The man was a genius, but they’re were charges brought against him for all kinds of things and by the time he came out of court years later, you know his business was bankrupt and he was gone.  I think he made twenty something like there were not many; they are big time collector items today.  But that was one example and I was very clear in the book that there is no definitive proof and again I’m not coming down on General Motors.

Sid: No, but that’s an example of, let’s suppose and we hear these stories all the time about of  you know fuel that will cause cars to run that will cost nothing.  Or engines that would cause fuel to be multiplied and the car companies buy them off or the gas and fuel companies buy them off.  But let’s assume that his allegations are true that they kept him in court so no one could get this new technology.  You explain, that if that be true, then there’s a curse on companies like General Motors and Ford.

Michael: Yeah Sid, again I’m a businessman, but, I’ve experienced this Sid, I’m not a perfect person, and yet I’m not a preacher or any of that stuff.  I’ve done things wrong in my life and I’ve repented and I’ve turned away from it.  I’ve lived on both sides of this deal.  Look I want everybody to know that, I’ve lived on both sides.  I’ve been cursed, things I’ve cursed myself for and I’ve had to go back and get on my face before God and get clean with Him and then bam, it starts the blessings begin to flow, minutes later.  So if you got listeners, I’m sure you do they said, “Man I’ve screwed up, Mike Galiga is perfect,” I’m way far from perfect, I’ve made many mistakes.  If your there and you do this the blessings will begin to flow within minutes.

Sid: So, your saying, that if this allegation is true and the head’s of say General Motors or Ford were to repent over this curse that their under it would turn maybe even that new invention you were talking about would come forth.

Michael: Yes, with the curse there, I don’t think that there is any hope for them, I don’t.

Sid: The principal’s that you explain in your book, there so profound I think only a businessman and not a preacher could have come up with them, as such easily understood principals.

Michael: Well, they are really easy to understand, they are very simple, they are not hard to get.  In fact they’re so simple that they’re kind of astounding like you mean that’s all I have to do is forgive people, the power of forgiveness in forgiving others and forgiving yourself?  It’s pretty simple and I walk people through on how to do it step by step and it frees them.

Sid: There was as something that happened to you that really changed your whole life with God, it happened in 2,005.  You had just watched a documentary on King David, what happened?

Michael: Well, it was a documentary on TV Sid, it was very very well done, excellent production, casting and I was flipping channels and there it was, I couldn’t take my eyes off of it.  And it was about King David and his sin and how the Prophet came in and said you know with his old bony fingers and said, “You’re the man.”  And King David, the actor in this movie, got down on his face before the Lord, put his arms out and just wept before the Lord and confessed what he had done wrong and asked for forgiveness and said, “God you know don’t take Your Spirit from me, renew Your Spirit in me.”  And it was just like a lightning bolt to my heart.  I said, “That is the one thing I’ve been looking for to conclude this process and kind of bring it 360.  I got up and went in my closet Sid, and a lot of people come out of their closet and I’m not making fun of anybody.  I went into my closet; I was going the reverse direction, a lot of times the world does the opposite of what they should.   I went in the closet, I went in there for two hours and got on my face before God and I confessed everything that I could possibly think of and if I couldn’t think of anymore I asked Him to tell me more and He did.  And I said, “I’m sorry for this, and I’m sorry for that and I’m going to make this right and I’m really sorry for that and would you heal me of this help me forgive this person; and I do forgive them now, it was on and on.”  And when I came out of that closet Sid, I was not the same person.

Sid: What difference did you see in your life?

Michael: Crystal clear conviction, crystal clear direction, I felt whole; it would be like a heart patient that needs a bypass and they don’t realize ten years earlier the disease started until one day they can’t walk up a flight of stairs.  And that’s the way it is with our bodies like in forgiveness if we don’t forgive somebody, part of our soul, part of us in the past, it’s locked.

Sid: In your book you talk about what happened when you began to forgive people to you what you experienced.

Michael: Yeah, pieces of me came back to me Sid, you know some businessman let’s say named Bob in Indiana he had done something really bad to me and I would go to the Lord and I would say “God, I’m forgiving Bob, I’m forgiving him right now.”  And in fact and this is the key this is in Oklahoma we say “That this is like throwing gasoline on the campfire, it’s a blazing what happens.”  I said, “Not only am I forgiving Bob, I am blessing him with my own lips, I am blessing him in the morning, I’m blessing him in the night when he turns over, I’m blessing his family, I’m blessing…

Sid: Now Mike is not talking theory, he’s not some college professor, he has been downloaded strategies from Heaven that result in mega million dollar deals and he’s written what God has shown him in his book.  The title is “Win Every Battle,” conquer fear, walk in the victory that God has promised you in your life.”